Mediocre Movie Club Movie Reviews

Y tu mamá también

11/26/2014

3.58
A-

"This movie captures the 17-18 year old male transition into something a little more adult." - Blair
"Cuaron creates a giant universe where butterflies are flapping their wings and creating tsunamis down the road, making it feel real and endless." - Jon
"I thought circle jerk, ookie cookie type stuff was just urban legend." - Riley

Joe, B+ "I would not recommend this movie for everyone, as the awkwardness might be too much for some to handle."

Let me first say that I really enjoyed this movie. I know some of you really don't like the subtitles, but they really don't bother me. My only concern with foreign language films is whether or not, we as viewers, are losing context or meaning during translation. At times during Y tu mama tambien I caught myself thinking that the dialogue between Tenoch, Julio, and Luisa to be over the top in its vulgarity. I'm not so sure if that was purposeful or just a project of loose translation. I'm leaning towards purposeful, as I don't see Alfonso Cuarón allowing such a clumsy translation to the English speaking audience.

Much of the build-up, trailers, or blurbs for the movie really focused on the film being a summer coming of age story for two teenage boys. That sort of theme absolutely screams awkward interactions that only teenage boys can bring. The penis jokes, awkward shower banter, and even a duel poolside jerking off race that included climax conversation didn't catch me of guard, because after all, these are teenage boys and teenage boys do, say, and talk about whatever their penis tells them to talk about. Other than the Zapata family business, Tenoch and Julio didn't strike me as remarkable in any way.

The thing that really caught me by surprise, and really I feel it's the film's most important theme, is how fucking rapey this shit is. Look, I know what you are going to say: "But the boys are of age, how can that be rape?" Look, I don't fucking know how old Tenoch and Julio are, but I know they act like a couple of god damn 14 year olds still trying figure out how and where it's appropriate to stick their dicks. They usually figure out the most inappropriate place and head there first. (See examples of each other's girlfriends, diving board jerk race, married twenty something family member, etc.)

My point is, these two idiots are barely in control of themselves and dear old scorned (by both her body and her husband) Luisa decides to take advantage of the situation. She slowly introduces sexual dialogue throughout the road trip, eventually building up to the point that discussing sexual partners and styles is casually exchanged between the three. From the perspective of an experienced adult, it's pretty clear the boys, despite their bravodocious demeanors, haven't the slightest clue of how to engage her on this level.

Of course this proves true as Luisa allows both boys to attempt their best Bald Bull Charge on her vag. Each boy was left apologizing and with Luisa more firmly in control than before.

Of course that control plays out to the devils threesome where the boys encourage each other's company more than ever. It's a scene that is shocking not for its content, but instead for how far Luisa has expanded her control over the best friends. I guess you could say there is a certain amount of foreshadowing throughout the film that might lead done to believe that this sexual encounter between Yenoch and Julio was inevitable. But I think the scenes people could bring up are merely just great examples of teenage boys being teenage boys. If I have a problem with the film it's that it didn't explore the boys emotions about anything that happened following the roadtrip. The narrator simply said the boys found new girlfriends and drifted apart. What the fuck? You build up this movie to a gayish (maybe gay, maybe rapey coercion) threesome and then you just dismiss it? I wanted more dialogue there.

Like I said, I really enjoyed the movie. Both Tenoch and Julio are well played and Cuarón shows he has a gift for getting in the mind of tortured male youth. (Prisoner of Azkaban anyone?) I'm worried that the rapiness is to subtle for audiences to recognize, but I don't think it detracts from how will the movie was made. I would not recommend this movie for everyone, as the awkwardness might be too much for some to handle. That said, I like it at a B+.

26 Comments

Sean

11/26/2014 02:53:13 am

I have a bias against foreign films and subtitles mostly because I prefer to be able to do 2 or 3 other things while watching a movie at home instead of be completely focused and engaged. That said I agree with Joe and say this was a pretty good movie.

Rapey? Maybe legally it was rapey, I’d have the boys pegged closer to 17-18 since they seemed to be off to college after the summer. Plus as a Carollaphile I’ll follow his guidance that it’s not rape if you masturbate to it in the future and I’m pretty sure Julian and Tenoch keep Luisa in the spankbank even if they try to forget about the 3-way. Which, if the boys had been fans of the Lonely Island Boys they would’ve realized that “it’s not gay when it’s in a 3-way” Perhaps The Golden Rule could’ve saved their friendship.

I don’t know if Luisa is as maniupulative as Joe suggests, she really just calls the boys’ bluff and makes their fantasies come true. She’s able to recognize these two idiots have one thing on their mind and decides to make her last days memorable for these two boys who she feels an admiration for their closeness. Which is why she flips out and begins to leave when she realizes the boys weren’t fighting because she fucked one then the other it’s because that jealousy has brought to the surface an ugly division between the two and the brotherhood manifesto they proclaim to live by. Only after she takes charge do they begin to repair their friendship and become attractive to her again, I don’t believe she had intended the 3-way to turn out quite like it did because she would’ve known the damage it would do to them. I did chuckle in the coffee shop meeting between the two boys when it came up that their old friend Daniel, who had been described earlier as having left the group because he was gay even though they also said they were ok with it, has a new girlfriend.

The performances from all 3 were solid; the story was engaging easy to follow. I typically don’t like the narrator fill the gaps style of story-telling but I felt like in this instance it was perfect in letting me get to know the characters better and more quickly and allowing the story to move along without stumbling through less than interesting bits. I’m going to knock it down to an A- because of the next paragraph.

I hated the jerk off race, have any of you even considered doing this? I thought circle jerk, ookie cookie type stuff was just urban legend. I didn’t like the twist put on the 3-way. I’m not saying it can’t happen that 2 seemingly straight guys can’t get drunk and lost in the moment in a 3some but the key word here is seemingly. I guarantee these 2 idiots would’ve spent the entire time in the grocery store shopping and ride over to pick up Luisa game-planning the logistics should the circumstance arise that it was 3-way time. It was their plan for crying out loud. They’re not getting lost in each other’s eyes and going at it, they would give a nod and a wink and move into fingercuffs.

Shane

11/29/2014 02:59:33 am

There is no doubt in my mind that some dudes jerk off around each other. I think Howard Stern talked about it in his book, actually. Although that may have been a one-time thing as opposed to something casual.

I guess maybe this does lend towards Julio and Tenoch being higher on the gay spectrum. Is it a spectrum? I think so.

Jon

11/29/2014 07:27:13 am

Cosign to this. I don't think a single gay experience makes a person homosexual. Also taking into account how granola Tenoch's mother is (talk of auras, allowing Tenoch's girlfriend to spend the night), it makes sense that he would be so comfortable with his sexuality and then transfer that comfort to Julio, maybe even making fun of his discomfort and further escalating.

11/29/2014 02:55:42 pm

I loved how Tenoch's mom carefully stepped across the stones in the pathway one by one. It was a subtle touch, but helped drive home where Tenoch came from.

Joe

11/30/2014 04:57:28 am

I have no idea if teenage boys jerk off around each other. I do know that a shit ton of guys I knew growing up talk like they did. Teenage boys are fucking weird.

That scene at the pool was pretty brave to put on film. It's one of those things that is talked about in a locker room, but nobody ever knows if it's true or not. Maybe Tenoch and Julio will spawn an entire generation of poolside jerk off champions like Mexico has never witnessed before.

Phil

11/26/2014 04:41:24 am

“Y Tu Mama Tambien” is a tour de force in minimalist filmmaking while also delving into the very real issues of the Mexican “machismo” culture.

Director Alfonso Cuaron wastes no showing his audience what this story is going to be about. The first shot is Diego Luna’s bare ass. Alrighty then! Cuaron immediately establishes one pretty key fact about Tenoch and Julio: they’re super-horny teenage boys. And when super-horny teenage boys aren’t getting any regularly, they’re going to get bored. So bored they’ll have jack-off contests on diving boards.

They finally find something to do when they meet Luisa at a wedding and start making up some trip to a beach they made up. This was, of course, not long after both begged their girlfriends to not bang anyone while they’re backpacking across Europe. These rules of what is and isn’t infidelity only apply to the girls apparently. In the wedding scene with Luisa, it looks like harmless flirting though, as Tenoch and Julio clearly have no intention of ever following up on this trip with Luisa. Until, of course, Luisa miraculously agrees to go.

The trip is pretty uneventful until Luisa decides to have sex with Tenoch in what can only be described as one of the most raw sex scenes ever captured to film. Julio sees them and the unravelling begins. At this point, we really delve into this “machismo” culture that prevails in Mexico. Julio almost immediately tells Tenoch that he has had sex with Tenoch’s girlfriend. It was as if he was trying to even the score on the number of women each has conquered, and now we’re all tied up at 2-2 again. Until, of course, Tenoch confesses to have sex with Julio’s girlfriend. 3-2.

Luisa eventually becomes complacent in this game of one upping, recognizing that she has broken a balance between the two. She decides she has to act quickly to bring this balance back by hooking up with Julio in the car. At this point, we’re seeing the women involved in the machismo game. Cuaron presents it to the audience as an accepted truth that sex is a game and the number of “pelts” a man can gather, ultimately proving his worth as a man. This point isn’t driven home any harder than when Julio claims to have had sex with Tenoch’s mother, and Tenoch doesn’t even care. At this point, it’s no longer about the emotion or that these women are people. It’s about the game, and Tenoch accepts that Julio has won and just continues to drink. This is why the “charloastra code” comes back, as the charloastra code is essentially the set of rules that govern this machismo culture. I loved this scene not only because it drove this point home, but also because of how it was filmed. Cuaron films the entire scene in a single shot with a hand camera (which is standard throughout), almost as if it is a mini-play that is being performed between Tenoch, Luisa, and Julio, which they pulled off masterfully, as all three gave amazing performances throughout.

So, when the boys realize that they have feelings for each other, we have a problem. This doesn’t make sense culturally. Men conquer women, they brag about said conquest, and they move on. Emotion and feelings are not a factor in a relationship. The relationship is a means to an end. We learn that after their final chance meeting, Tenoch and Julio never see each other again. It’s a failure of the culture that forces them to feel like they cannot be together.

This final scene also gives us the chance to learn Luisa’s fate, and we learn that she has passed away from cancer that she was diagnosed with before the trip even began. This completely reframed many of her actions throughout the movie and made her a character that made sense. Initially, we knew that she left Jano due to his infidelity, and that motivation would have been enough. Except, we get the reveal that she’s known about Jano’s transgressions for quite a while. Jano confessing almost gives her permission to go. This would explain most of her actions, but why is she obsessed with the 98 year old women? And why is she so determined to make this trip work? The cancer reveal puts those scenes in new light. I thought it was very smart to save this reveal until the end, as giving the audience this information beforehand would have cast a very different light over the movie.

Cuaron also interjects thoughts on political corruption throughout, with the main characters regularly driving by military police, Julio’s jabs at Tenoch’s father being a crooked politician, and subplot about Chuy being forced out of fishing by the local tourism board. I’m not entirely sure why these things were there other than it didn’t take a lot of time, but it felt superfluous to the narrative. I’m already depressed enough about the f

11/26/2014 04:42:24 am

Cuaron also interjects thoughts on political corruption throughout, with the main characters regularly driving by military police, Julio’s jabs at Tenoch’s father being a crooked politician, and subplot about Chuy being forced out of fishing by the local tourism board. I’m not entirely sure why these things were there other than it didn’t take a lot of time, but it felt superfluous to the narrative. I’m already depressed enough about the fate of our three protagonists; do I really need to be bummed out by the fisherman too?

“Y Tu Mama Tambien” is a triumph in shedding a damning light on the machismo culture that persists in Mexico. The film initially presents itself as a conflict between Tenoch and Julio, but it is in actuality a conflict between the two of them and their culture. Ultimately, they lose this battle. All the while, we get to see amazing performances from Diego Luna, Gael Garcia Bernal, and Maribel Verdu, and Alfonso Cuaron gives them a chance to really show their abilities with amazing minimalist directing, several great long takes, and a couple jarring sex scenes. This is a movie I’m going to remember for quite a while. Great pick Joe.

+ Excellent commentary on the machismo culture
+ Smart to reveal Luisa’s cancer at the end
+ Cuaron does a fantastic job with the minimalist directing
+ Three lead actors are all amazing
- Superfluous political messaging

Grade: Even with the negative, I still go A+

11/29/2014 03:14:36 pm

Was this film on your radar before Joe picked it?

11/30/2014 03:21:02 am

Heard of it but really had no idea what it was about or any intention to watch it.

Blair

11/26/2014 05:07:11 am

Alright, my first review! I liked this movie. As a fan of all "coming of age" things, I think this movie captures the 17/18 year old (mostly- making a gross generalization) male transition into something a little more adult like. Each character is experiencing transition and the "first" of many things.

I think a good movie should stick with you. You should be questioning scenes, dialogue, actions, etc after. Here is one of my questions after watching: Is it really a thing to masturbate/ masturbate race in front of or with another person?
A) I can't put anything beyond the scope of two teenage boys that are clearly very comfortable with one another.

After I read Joe's review I thought more about Luisa's actions. I do not think they are rapey. I think she is just deeply grieving. Grieving her sickness even more so than her failed marriage. In fact, I think the failed marriage is an analogy to her failed body and sets the stage for her actions. Out of grief people do some weird shit. Her sexual exploits with the boys-- grieving the loss of her marriage but also, probably a way to leave something of herself with the world. She tries to teach them how to be better lovers and friends and in general, she teaches them about embracing life. I think they would take her advice with their next relationships. Moreover, it is clear they are both affected by her death. She gave them more than just sexual advice- she gave them experiences that are unforgettable and that shaped them forever.

Not a movie I would want to watch regularly, but I definitely liked it. B+

11/29/2014 03:13:30 pm

Blair, as a teacher of youth, would you recommend this movie to your more mature youth? Maybe some recent graduates? Or is it too risque?

11/29/2014 04:40:47 pm

Personally I wouldn't consider it too risque, the movie has plenty to offer otherwise and although some of the shots were unnecessary I wouldn't consider it gratuitous.

11/30/2014 04:36:58 am

Define youth. There's a lot going on here that I'm not sure the average youth can grasp or should grasp.

To what age does Blair have kids, 18?

11/30/2014 01:27:42 pm

She has them in her youth group until they graduate high school. But a lot of them still hang around after.

11/26/2014 03:01:55 pm

I've got this movie down as an A on the spreadsheet, and was excited to watch it again. I had forgotten about all the narration, and how thoroughly Cuaron layers in Luisa's diagnosis throughout. This made Y Tu Mama Tambien so much more affecting this time around, shifting the focus from the story of two horny teenagers to a woman who is preparing for her death. The former is great on its own, but the latter is even better.

Luisa's path is equal to Tenoch's and Julio's based on the presence of several scenes that are all about her. This is the rare movie with three lead performances. Tenoch's and Julio's is what the marketing is based around, but Luisa's struck me as so much more interesting. I'd call the theme of Y Tu Mama Tambien the inevitable ending of everything. Luisa's marriage and life, Tenoch's and Julio's friendship, their relationships with their girlfriends, the reign of the dominant Mexican political party, Chuy's family fishing legacy, and the lives of so many people in the background. Cuaron chooses those asides on purpose. From the early break of the dead cyclist holding up traffic to the dead child in the Arizona desert to the crosses that litter the roadside, finality is all over the film. With Luisa, a lot of the movie is about the last time she's going to do something. The camera lingers over her apartment because it's the last time she's going to be there. With Tenoch and Julio, this is the last time they get drunk together, the last time they recite the charolastra oath, the last time they have a threesome and make out with each other. Luisa's last line is about becoming one with the ocean, a force that inexorably wears things away and will outlast all life on the planet, but will still experience its own ending in the far-distant future.

The seeds of those endings are organically planted in these doomed relationships. It's amazing that Tenoch's and Julio's friendship has lasted this long. They're the last two dedicated charolastras, down from five. The class differences between the two of them don't make things easier. Tenoch's elite status makes him entitled and high-handed with Julio, calling him a hick and only lifting toilet seats with his foot. Julio's lesser middle class upbringing means he's always behind his best friend, not getting to share in Tenoch's travel experiences, and always lighting a match when he uses his friend's bathroom. Their break in the end seems inevitable, as a difference in location is only going to exacerbate those intrinsic differences between the two of them. Luisa's cancer literally starts as an out-of-control seed that slowly takes over her whole body. Her relationship with Jano is based on their shared difficult relationships with mother figures, who are difficult in the first place because of other, natural events. Their marriage is then tainted by the gap in their interests and by her memory of her first boyfriend who died in a random accident. The cyclist's death is rooted in road construction, and the planning way back when that placed the bridge in one spot and not the other. Cuaron creates a giant universe where butterflies are flapping their wings and creating tsunamis down the road, making it feel real and endless.

11/29/2014 03:08:10 am

Is the ending of everything the point? For Luisa, I felt like it was about takin control and leaving a stamp. It's preventing her ending for at least a period of time, which would be until the guys for or are too old to remember. She'll also be remembered by that family. She's creating a legacy.

11/29/2014 07:19:47 am

Except her final wishes are for the family to never talk about her again. Jano probably never saw her again and was too pompous to talk about being left by her, Tenoch and Julio certainly thought about her but may or may not have talked about her, and Chuy's kids are probably too young to remember her. The narrator makes a point to mention that she has no other family. I'm with you on taking control, but not on making a stamp.

11/29/2014 02:57:49 pm

I could be wrong, but wasn't it that she didn't want the guys never mentioned again? I might need to rewatch the final 5 minutes to confirm, though.

If I'm correct, does that change your analysis?

I know if I'm wrong, it definitely changes some of mine.

11/29/2014 03:29:17 pm

I think both readings are valid (things end vs. making a mark). A roadside cross is a memorial to a life, but it's also a symbol of a death. The arc of the movie is a negative path, such that things that existed at the beginning don't at the end, so the more fatalistic reading fits with that arc.

11/26/2014 03:02:57 pm

Boyhood remains my favorite movie for 2014, because it contains so many alternate universes. The movie could have been about a friend the main character leaves behind, or a Mexican construction worker, or the children of a violent alcoholic. Its filled with stories equally, if not more interesting than the one the movie is actually about. Y Tu Mama Tambien is the same. The interlude where Tenoch chooses not to stop in his nanny's hometown implies a movie about a 13 year old girl who moves to Mexico City, struggles, gets a job as a nanny in an upper class home, and becomes closer to the kids than the parents. The restaurant with the old woman and the roadside sale is another, with several generations of women scraping out a living. The central threesome passes a VW Bug dressed up in Just Married decorations that implies another movie. The Mexican president leaving from the wedding and heading to the meeting that would become the infamous Battle in Seattle, which was actually made into its own movie. How deeply Cuaron fleshes out the world is a huge asset, making time spent in Y Tu Mama Tambien not enough, a sign of a great movie.

Like Boyz N the Hood, another thing that jumped out to me is how universal Tenoch's and Julio's behavior is. Seeing similarities across different ethnic groups is how empathy is born, and gives me a warming glowing warming glow. I disagree with Phil's emphasis on Mexican machismo, because this movie could be set anywhere. Berlin teenagers driving through rural Germany, Mumbai teenagers driving through Indian flood plains, Tokyo teenagers driving through Japanese hillsides. All would talk about the times they've been laid and make each other smell their farts. They exhibit insult escalation, a vital skill for male teenagers in the shower scene, and they call each other gay slurs because nothing's more important than masculinity. Machismo is just the Spanish word for what's ubiquitous among teenagers everywhere.

To heap more praise on Cuaron, I love his style of relying on single shots as much as possible. The shot taking in Luisa's apartment and then leaning out the window to find Tenoch and Julio, the tracking shot through the old woman's restaurant, the shots and toasts at the end, the single take sex scenes, all phenomenal. I love the underwater shots, the claustrophobia of Tenoch's, Julio's, and Luisa's first meeting, the placing of the jerk-off contest between the scenes of Luisa getting her diagnosis. All the things happening in the roadside communicate how privileged the central threesome is. Narration is very often a negative, but I loved it here, from the way the sound dropped out for a couple of seconds to what was actually communicated. I talked about sense memory way back when in The Sea Inside, and Y Tu Mama Tambien nailed it through the narration. The three main performances are all excellent and naturalistic, with emotion, intensity, and comic timing with the finger in the ass/flat tire sequence.

Thematically, technically, artistically, Y Tu Mama Tambien is flawless. I spent the first viewing very much immersed in the characters, buying into the popular narrative about the movie being a well-made Mexican road trip/sex romp. I still loved it, but the ending completely throws the entire film into a new perspective. Seeing it for a second time with knowledge of the ending elevates an A movie to a richer, more profound state, such that I think this has to join the ranks of my 26 other A+ movies. Dirk Diggler's fake dick, meet Gael Garcia Bernal's real one.

11/30/2014 03:26:20 am

Totally disagree with your comment that this could be set in any country and the teens would do the same thing. Being around enough Indian people in my life now tells me they are a huge no to this. I think I would buy a handful of Western Europe places (Italian especially).

This relationship view feels like a real thing to me from my encounters with Mexican culture. I admit my view is limited as I have never been to the country, but there is definitely a prevailing idea that providing security is the man's job, and actually caring for your partner is secondary at best.

11/27/2014 05:21:56 am

Alright. So do we review movies with the lens of Americans or do we reviews them with an understanding that other cultures differ from ours? I’m not sure. I do know that I’m willing to bypass one of the negatives that I would hold against this movie if it were American. I think it’s important that we view this as a Mexican made movie with different values and not as a Hispanic extension of our own culture.

I see three themes in this movie that are brilliantly fleshed out.

The first is the coming of age angle. We’re looking at two older teenage boys who are ending what is the equivalent of their high school degrees. Unlike most coming of age movies, this one rams sexuality right in your face. I feel like the teenage boy psyche is well covered, though most movies refuse to cover teenage boy sexuality as anything more than something to joke about. (See the American Pie series, which the first one did a great job in approaching teenage sexuality.) Y Tu Mama Tambien does a great job of demonstrating the awkwardness that boys go through when they begin to embrace their sexuality. They act cocky but don’t even know why. I like that we have a rich kid and a poor kid her. Both talking shit. Neither knowing what they’re doing. Their best attribute as a lover is a physical presence and an apology. We see these guys grow from confident to deflated to wanting to be lead. And we see their friendship go from a place of dishonest machismo to anger to attraction to rejection. This is the most obvious theme and Cuaron nails it.

The next theme is Luisa. I think this is the most important theme of the movie, though it may not be the most obvious. Do you remember the doctor’s office scene? I didn’t the first time I viewed this movie. On my second watch, I saw the doctor’s office scene and realized that the entire movie was set up by that brief scene with the article in a magazine and a closing doctor’s office door. We ignore it, but it’s clear that Luisa is sick. We hear the article results and then we’re thrown forward to her affair. Cuaron does a great job here of letting us succumb to our nature and thinking, “Oh, this woman is upset because of her affair.” Instead, we find out in the end, she grieving her own death. This isn’t a bullshit add on at the end, the movie tells us just enough in the doctor’s office to let us know.

So Luisa reads that magazine and realizes that no one might remember her. That’s not the fate she wants. Instead, she sees an opportunity and takes it. At first, she wants something mindless, but finds quickly that there is no such thing. Instead, she finally takes control of her life and her body, which is about to turn on her and kill her. She doesn’t see Jano as a bad guy or a good guy. She just wants to live her life out as she pleases. We think we’re getting a woman spurred by a man and instead Cuaron drops a bomb on us that she was dying and that this was all about her making memories for herself and for other. We see the boys in the future, and like Luisa’s biker boyfriend who dies in a fiery death, she has made a memory in their lives. She’s told the magazine to fuck itself. She’s outlived her mortal coil.

The third theme is a love movie to rural Mexico. A key to this is making Luisa from Spain. This love story mirrors Luisas concerns about not being remembered, I think. There are all these subtle nods to rural Mexico that we can quickly gloss over as quaint like Tenoch and Julio do. They’re so focused on fucking Luisa (and I don’t blame them) that they didn’t even pay attention to what was around them. Cuaron is probably making a statement that youth just aren’t going to remember any of this unless we give them a reason to remember. So Cuaron gives us this movie in the same way Luisa fucks Tenoch and Julio. He gives us something interesting and dynamic to remember.

So, now we can talk about culture. First, let’s talk about the gay angle. Was it gay? Maybe? It seems to be played as a moment of passion. Not for a second do I believe there two guys are gay, but they’re definitely having a gay moment. Do we need more than that moment? Nope. It just goes to the overwhelming feelings that accompany teenage sexuality. The boys don’t need to label themselves any further. It was simply a thing that happened that they’re not comfortable with sober. It just shows that sexuality is so incredibly complicated and changing that maybe even throwing a definition or limit on it would be a silly thing to do. Regardless, that interaction in 2014 barely catches your attention. In 2002 when this movie came out, it was a huge deal. We just weren’t publicly where we are today. In 2002, it was still a big deal to find out someone is gay. Now? Who cares in this circle. Of course so and so was gay. We all knew it and none of us

11/27/2014 05:24:21 am

We all knew it and none of us cared and of course he could join our fraternity. That wasn’t the case when this movie came out. Kudos to them for telling the world to fuck itself.

Joe brings up a cultural angle that I never even thought of. That of rape. I just don’t see it. Not only do I see the boys as legally at least 18 (from what we see in the film), I just don’t think it matters. Not only does age of consent mean something different across different cultures, I just don’t see anything in the film that points towards Cuaron wanting this to be a topic at all. I don’t see Luisa as a predator, but rather she represents everything the boys need to learn about treating other people (not just women) as human beings who should be valued. There is no rape here. I don’t even think we have the time and space to discuss the fact that sex is a cultural concept in addition to a biological one.

So, as far as the foreign film angle, it seems like Mexican film makers looooove to verbally explain plot points that occur off screen. This not only goes for main characters, but side characters as well. The first time I watched this film. The “over” narration bothered me. But since then, I’ve watched some other Mexican films and realize that it just might be something that is done in Mexican films. I’m inclined to cede to them on this. The foreign verbal blurbs are by no mean smart, but in this movie I found them pretty informative.

But those blurbs lead to one of Cuaron’s biggest weaknesses as a writer/director. His dialogue is often clunky and inorganic. If this was spoken in English, it might have been even more cringe worthy at times. He has a lot to cover and just makes his characters get to the point. It’s not all bad, though, as he nails the dialogue between the boys. I laughed out loud at a couple of them, especially the fart scene. It’s funny, but also drives how immature these two are. Maybe this is a cultural thing as well, but unlike the narrator heavy background explanations, the dialogue is something that does distract me.
I think the performances were all around great. Maribel Verdu is no doubt on her way to be a finalist in the 2015 Mediocrities. I’m s I’ve seen Gael Garcia Bernal in other movies and he just hasn’t disappointed. Looking at his filmography, I was surprised that this was filmed after Amores Perros (which I recommend and so does Netflix after you watch Y Tu Mama Tambien) as he seems much younger here. I think it’s a credit to him to pull of the teenager. Diego Luna does a convincing job as a kinda spoiled teenager as well. They both pulled off those silent scenes where they’re reflecting on their shame that they won’t let the world see.

Luna and Garcia Bernal convince me of their friendship, which I know is supposed to be a theme of this movie. But it’s just not a theme that I thought was really explored as well as the others. I’ll let someone else discuss that if they want to.

I guess the last thing that I can think to talk about is the camera work. This is something I never paid attention to until we started this club. Cuaron takes a bunch of long shots that lazily move until our characters are off camera. Just drifting out into the world. It helps with the pace and build up to the end and tamps down the sexual tension, which just might be overwhelming without the respite Cuaron gives us visually. Some of the drifting camera also gives us those great glimpses of Mexico, from the rural beauty queen to the Julio’s porch overlooking Mexico City. It works on me the most when we drift into the kitchen of the restaurant as Luisa, Tenoch and Julio talk about nothing and everything, a conversation we don’t need to hear. We get to see the women running the restaurant and some sweet moves from that grandma after she takes a shot of something. Loved it. That said, some of the underwater scenes were a bit gratuitous, though I suppose they had meaning. Perhaps stripping the boys down to no outside distractions, just letting us see them alone. Or maybe just Cuaron wanted us to see lots of flaccid dong. Ok.

Hot takes:
-Luisa can be my dental hygienist any time.
-The goalkeeping commentary was great. Being nicknamed The Emperor would be awesome.
-Daniel Gimenez Cacho has a great voice and is soothing as the narrator. I wish Spanish class used him instead of the squeaky lady and baritone dude on those damn audio tapes.
-Did anyone else who has been to Mexico watch the shower scenes and think, “Don’t drink that water! You’ll get sick!”?
-Lots o’ dong.

In the end, I really liked this movie. It’s not perfect, but it’s in the A range for sure and I’m not certain I could be talked down or up. This is a clear A- to me.

11/30/2014 04:52:14 am

Its natural to view this movie through our American lens, and I certainly no doubt get my "rapey" uneasiness while watching the sex scenes from that perspective. It still doesn't take away the fact that Luisa is coercive and selfish throughout the film.

I'm not denigrating her selfishness, as who knows what the hell I would do if I were in her situation. But the scenes speak for themselves. Tenoch in his bath towel is confused and hesitant. Nervous? Sure, but he is certainly uneasy about her advances.

How would this have played out if it was 2 16-18 year old girls traveling with a late 20something? Luisia knows the boys are sexually attracted to her, as it's made obvious in their first encounter at the wedding. Their dicks might as well been dowsing sticks with homing signals. Luisia knows this and takes advantage of this. It's not a coincidence that she picked 2 inexperienced youths. They were targets.

Maybe their age makes it not rape, but this doesn't make her actions any less cringe worthy. She wants a legacy, and what better way than to leave it on two unsuspecting teens.

Tenoch and Julio think they have conquered a woman. In reality they are slave to their memories for the rest their lives.

11/30/2014 01:38:31 pm

I guess you can call it selfish, but it was selfish all the way around. Tenoch and Julio are just as selfish. but I guess that's something that I saw was a good thing for Luisa. She was taking control and doing something for herself. She didn't harm the guys at all. If anything, she improved them by making them respect a woman, which it's not clear they did before.

In general, I agree that much older people having sex with someone around the age of 18 is creepy, but we're not talking about something in general here. We are talking about a very specific situation. But in no way did I find her actions predatory nor did I find that their innocence was somehow tarnished. I don't think any of them were victims.

Bryan

12/3/2014 04:27:11 pm

Better late than never. Typing this up on my iPad so even shorter than usual! The pool scene was insanely weird, we have a pretty good cross section of formerly teenage males here and if it's weird to us, then it doesn't happen with any normal frequency in this country.

Maybe it's just Netflix, but this movie is not made for non-Spanish speaking lay people. The dialogue was often to fast to read and at times, because of yellow text, impossible to see. It seemed funny, but was too fast for my pea brain to process.

I'm not super into metaphors so I'll leave that to you all.

I really enjoyed Luisa screwing with the boys' minds. Their faux machismo didn't hold up so well. Good for her. She easily wins 2014 MMC best actress, but alas, just a bit late.

The narrator was gold throughout the movie - helped cut down the length, provided context, and added details only found In a book. The narrator was awful at the end as was the writing. I thought it was wrapped up Ina rather unemotional way for what actually happened.

Interesting story, great pacing, and good actors/actresses. Messed up subtitles and some outlandish scenes. Solid B, leaning B- but I need to look at other movies I feel similar about.

Y tu mamá también

3.58
A-

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Y tu mamá también

3.58A-

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3.58
A-